It is currently Wed May 23, 2018 11:53 am

All times are UTC [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 10 posts ] 
Author Message
jinglebells
PostPosted: Tue Jan 23, 2018 6:29 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 12, 2011 10:19 pm
Posts: 345
Reputation: 2

Hello all,

I'm getting worried that my BJ may fail an MoT from this year due to a missing EML (Engine Management Light). It's never had one, so I've never been bothered about it. But I think some models do, and I wonder what the score is? Will the MoT testers know which models have it and which don't?

By "some models", I mean that we have basically 10 set-ups at least:-
i.e. Five engines (1.3, 1.5, 1.8. 2.0 Sport, and Diesel) for both Pre- and Post-Facelift. There may be more variants, but from an EML perspective I suspect that is the list. My car is a pre-facelift 1.5.

So maybe one of the BJ electronic experts on here can advise. Could someone post a picture of the dash warning lights, so I know where to look for mine? Even if there is a space for it, there is no guarantee the relevant circuit is designed in of course!

My BA didn't have one either, and I assumed there wasn't supposed to be one. The main mod for a BJ (same engine) is the replacement of the mechanical distributor with electronic triggering of the ignition coils via Cam/Crank Angle Sensors. (The BA still had a lambda probe and MAF, two of the things that an EML would be useful for.)
.


Top
 Profile  
 
brucey76
PostPosted: Tue Jan 23, 2018 7:43 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2012 8:11 pm
Posts: 498
Location: Bowburn, Durham
Reputation: 4

if the eml isnt there, it cant light up and fail mot. plus I'm pretty sure this wont be its 1st mot


Top
 Profile  
 
jinglebells
PostPosted: Wed Jan 24, 2018 7:39 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 12, 2011 10:19 pm
Posts: 345
Reputation: 2

brucey76 wrote:
if the eml isnt there, it cant light up and fail mot. plus I'm pretty sure this wont be its 1st mot


Ok, that's what I was hoping ...
It's not its first MoT, no, I've had it a few years, but the MoT rules are changing this year, so I hear.
.


Top
 Profile  
 
brucey76
PostPosted: Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:34 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2012 8:11 pm
Posts: 498
Location: Bowburn, Durham
Reputation: 4

they cant move the goal posts on these cars, they're near classic.


Top
 Profile  
 
pitrack_1
PostPosted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 12:34 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jun 24, 2015 5:55 am
Posts: 470
Location: ACT, Australia
Reputation: 3

I can't answer for UK laws but in general in Oz vehicles only have to meet the regulations in force at the time they were first registered on the road and make sure "it all works" i.e all installed equipment related to running at the time works. So the question is if your vehicle had a "check engine" light (CEL) when first registered-if so it is required now and if not, no.

Exceptions are usually compelling health/safety related things like exclusion of asbestos from replacement components (gaskets, clutch & brake linings in particular) and removal of lead from fuel (necessitating either valve seat changes and/or substitute lubrication products in older vehicles).

I'd be surprised if any post mid-90's car didn't have a CEL, unless your vehicle continued using an engine + ECU combination designed without the light (or even a carburettor) that still met regulations (particularly emissions).

Patrick


Top
 Profile  
 
jinglebells
PostPosted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 10:44 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 12, 2011 10:19 pm
Posts: 345
Reputation: 2

Hello again
Thank you to Patrick and Brucey for the advice above.
I did a little digging around, and I think the post-facelift models (2001 on) have the EML, but the pre-facelift didn't. I'll get that confirmed in a few days I hope.
My concern is that if the light doesn't show then the MoT tester might think it's just been taken out to cover up a fault. But I agree that if it's not supposed to be there then it shouldn't be a problem.
.


Top
 Profile  
 
pitrack_1
PostPosted: Fri Jan 26, 2018 12:25 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jun 24, 2015 5:55 am
Posts: 470
Location: ACT, Australia
Reputation: 3

If your pink slip inspector chucks a wobbly (Oz slang for "MoT inspector queries it") point out that that particular engine model doesn't have it. It should be in the vehicle's handbook, saying something like "ECU lamp (certain models only)". Challenge him/her to prove that it should have.

In the meantime, relax! :toothy4: There are plenty of warning lights on many, many models of cars since who-knows-when that are for options not fitted or are inactive or even don't apply. This is because the dash is often standardised across all model levels and sometimes even different vehicles, with some lamps already there in preparation for future upgrades.

Case in point: when I was young we had a 1974 Volvo 144 "Grand Luxe"(which became the "GL") auto with the B20E fuel injected engine...and yes those details are important for the rest of the case! Being the pedantic detail-obsessive mechanically fiddly kid I was, I looked at the dash, identified all the lamps and read the handbook cover-to-cover (still probably the best one of any vehicle that I've ever read). There were three lamps that did not illuminate and their graphics were 'hidden' (not highlighted in white which was a peculiar requirement of Australian Design Rules I believe) but I could read them by shining a torch on them. they were "OD", "CH" and "EGR". Two were explained in the handbook: "OD"was Overdrive for the manual cars (had a Laycock de Normanville overdrive option) where ours was an automatic, "CH"was Choke for manual chokes on the carburetted versions, and "EGR" which as we all know now is "Exhaust Gas Recirculation". But back in the late 70's EGR was basically unknown- except California where it had been mandated since the early/mid 70's (73-75 or so). We even pulled the dash to try to fix a faulty odometer so I could see the "CH" and "OD" lamps were wired in, but the "EGR" lamp was not even there- blanked off. I got an inkling in the late 80's/early 90's when we had a car with a Gregory's (Haynes) manual which showed the EGR system. It wasn't until the advent of the mainstream internet and I looked up EGR I put 2-and-2 together and figured out it was there for the California/US market where (I believe) it was required for emissions reasons in case the system wasn't working.

Patrick


Top
 Profile  
 
brucey76
PostPosted: Fri Jan 26, 2018 9:58 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2012 8:11 pm
Posts: 498
Location: Bowburn, Durham
Reputation: 4

yes, I've had a few cars with similar systems. mk4 escort 1.4 petrol had the glow plug light blanked out with a little black sticky tape. same dash on all models but no need for it on petrol model. BA has "ice" warning light and "washer bottle low lights" that aren't used on my pre-ford zxi. neither were they on my post-ford


Top
 Profile  
 
jinglebells
PostPosted: Sat Jan 27, 2018 5:32 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 12, 2011 10:19 pm
Posts: 345
Reputation: 2

pitrack_1 wrote:

In the meantime, relax! There are plenty of warning lights on many, many models of cars since who-knows-when that are for options not fitted or are inactive or even don't apply. This is because the dash is often standardised across all model levels and sometimes even different vehicles, with some lamps already there in preparation for future upgrades.

There were three lamps that did not illuminate and their graphics were 'hidden' (not highlighted in white which was a peculiar requirement of Australian Design Rules I believe)
Patrick


This is exactly my dilemma! The BJ dash (warning lights area) is blacked out until they light up. So, does the car have a blacked out EML that could light up when a fault occurs, but where the bulb has been taken out by the previous owner because it was on, :? or does the car have no system to light it up, or even no light position at all?!!

I should know soon, because I'm comparing the handbooks of both pre- and post-facelifts. I know for sure that some (at least) of the post-facelift BJs have an EML.
.


Top
 Profile  
 
jinglebells
PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2018 4:07 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 12, 2011 10:19 pm
Posts: 345
Reputation: 2

jinglebells wrote:

I should know soon, because I'm comparing the handbooks of both pre- and post-facelifts. I know for sure that some (at least) of the post-facelift BJs have an EML.
.


I have the answer now: In my car's handbook, (the page showing the dash instruments and warning lights) there is no mention of an engine management light. But in the later model (I have obtained a 2002 handbook) it is there, pictured and labelled "* = some models".

So I think I'm ok, provided the MoT tester understands the difference!
.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 10 posts ] 

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  

Protected by Anti-Spam ACP Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
Karma functions powered by Karma MOD © 2007, 2009 m157y